Discussions specific to tape backups
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techguy615
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by techguy615 » Jan 17, 2014 7:38 pm

I have reconfigured my job to use the reverse incremental. I did see where the job was limited to only letting me select 2 as the number of restore points. I have also noticed if I entered a 1 manually instead of clicking the up/down arrows it doesn't complain about it though. That might not be a good thing though. As for the registry entry you are referencing, I am apparently missing it. Nothing like showing up late for the game.

Thanks for all of the help thus far. I am very new to the product at this point.

v.eremin
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by v.eremin » Jan 17, 2014 8:41 pm

techguy615 wrote: As for the registry entry you are referencing, I am apparently missing it. Nothing like showing up late for the game.
No problem. This is the registry key I was talking about. This regkey was designed specifically for rotated media scenario, and, once implemented, it will enable automatic cleanup of the backup repository from all existing files if any backup file from the latest full backup chain is missing. So, it might be worth taking a look.

Thanks.

techguy615
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by techguy615 » Jan 17, 2014 9:20 pm

Sounds good. I downloaded the patch and added the reg keys. Will see what happens.

v.eremin
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by v.eremin » Jan 19, 2014 8:41 pm

Kindly, keep us updated about the results you get, as this functionality has been added just recently, and we're more than willing to get the relevant feedback regarding it. Thanks.

GarthH
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by GarthH » Jan 22, 2014 2:02 am

Hi

I am still messing around trying to get my GFS setup properly and have the issues mentioned by OP

Would an alternative to scripting be a second backup job (for each job) that is set to do an active full and only run on saturday
Then use this job as the source for the job to tape? With only 1 restore point set, it archives to tape every week and then overwrites itself for the next weekly
And your last weekly of the month you keep as your monthly?

foggy
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by foggy » Jan 23, 2014 3:16 pm

GarthH wrote:Would an alternative to scripting be a second backup job (for each job) that is set to do an active full and only run on saturday
Yep, this is also a viable approach, however requiring the production VMs to be disturbed twice.

techguy615
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by techguy615 » Jan 27, 2014 5:32 pm

Update: I have been a bit detained in reporting back the results of this. It appears the reverse incremental will give me what I need with a full backup writing to disk at the end of the day. The VM I am working with is approximately 2TB in size, so it takes a while to complete. Removal of the snapshot used is painfully slow, as it took 3hrs 42mins to be removed before the job showed as completed and the backup copy could begin. I just changed to the reverse incremental over the weekend. That seems to have worked fine writing to my NAS device. I am now waiting for the Backup Copy job to finish writing to my 4TB locally attached drive. The hope is that I will end up with the full backup plus one other restore point to take to a vault. If all goes well the job will hopefully be done by the end of the day.

techguy615
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by techguy615 » Jan 28, 2014 4:43 pm

Ok, so it is 10.5 hours that my backup copy is running and it appears that I am only 36% complete. It is a great idea, but I am not so sure it will work for me if it takes 24+ hours to copy from a NAS device to a locally attached Hard drive. Showing my bottleneck being the source, I guess that means the NAS device I am copying it from is sucking wind. I am a bit perplexed though because it is a 12 spindle device and it doesn't seem the network card is being maxed out at all. I would think the local eSATA hard drive I am copying to would be the weakest link. Keep in mind this is from one server to another in the same rack with a gigabit connection. Any ideas? I just want to get a full backup on a drive to take it off-site.

v.eremin
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by v.eremin » Jan 29, 2014 8:35 am

Yep, it seems that your "source" storage can't provide data any faster.

However, be aware that there is always bottleneck in every deployment. So, just message regarding source being the bottleneck doesn't indicate anything, more interesting the full bottleneck statistics with percent distribution and the total backup copy job speed.

Thanks.

MaartenK
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by MaartenK » Feb 11, 2014 10:32 am

mongie wrote: I too am waiting for this functionality...

example:

We keen 5 points of retention on all our backup jobs which run daily, monday to friday (and use archive jobs to keep archive retention).

We run MONTHLY backup to tape jobs for all our backups.

With 5 retention points set on the jobs, we normally have 2 full backups on disk at any one time (Forward Incremental - Dedupe unit). Because we only run the tape job monthly, each time it runs, both full backups are new to the tape job, and it writes both. Some of these backups are 2TB+ and this takes too long to write to tape.
sorry to hijack this topic but it was an interesting one.

We almost have the same configuration but with a longer retention to disk

Monday to Thursday Incremental and Friday a Full. With a retention on disk with 21 restore points.
A Copy job is made to another offsite repository to keep 14 restore points, 4 week, 12 months.
But we must keep data on tape (company policy). So we have even more Full backups on the primary site. This means all .vbk files will be put on tape (we run a backup to tape on Saturday). And we also have 2TB+ vbk files. so 6 .vbk files will be backupped on tape :shock:.

An option like "only backup latest Full backup to tape" would be a welcome one.

Otherwise you could use Incremental > synthetic full > with transformation. Then only one .vbk will be left on onsite and the backup to tape only sees one .vbk file? Correct me if i’m wrong

v.eremin
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by v.eremin » Feb 11, 2014 11:45 am

Otherwise you could use Incremental > synthetic full > with transformation. Then only one .vbk will be left on onsite and the backup to tape only sees one .vbk file?
With such settings, tape job will, indeed, see and copy only one .vbk file. Actually, you might as well switch to reversed incremental mode in order to have only one ("the latest") backup on disk which, then, will be copied to tape mediums.

Thanks.

MaartenK
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by MaartenK » Feb 11, 2014 11:55 am

v.Eremin wrote: With such settings, tape job will, indeed, see and copy only one .vbk file. Actually, you might as well switch to reversed incremental mode in order to have only one ("the latest") backup on disk which, then, will be copied to tape mediums.

Thanks.
thank you for your reply. That would be an option. But that doesn’t have any effect on how the "backup Copy job" works. This job still processes the latest backups to the offsite repository?

under advanced > incremental the text says "Recommanded for backup to tape"? This acutely means that reverse backups are better for backup to tape then a more traditional way with incremental and synthetic fulls?

The option "last full backup to tape" would be the best :wink:. Hope Veeam will consider this option in a feature release

v.eremin
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by v.eremin » Feb 11, 2014 12:06 pm

This job still processes the latest backups to the offsite repository?
The mode used by "source" backup job doesn't affect backup copy job, as it creates restore points in "target" location, using its own synthetic logic.
under advanced > incremental the text says "Recommanded for backup to tape"?
It depends on the goals customer is trying to achieve. Generally, it's recommended to utilize forward incremental mode in case of tapes, since, this way, only incremental data, not the full backup, will be transferred on everyday basis.

However, your case appears to be different from the one mentioned above, and, thus, reversed incremental suites your needs better.
The option "last full backup to tape" would be the best :wink:. Hope Veeam will consider this option in a feature release
Yes, we do consider adding such or similar functionality in one of next product releases.

Thanks for the feedback; much appreciated.

sbbots
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by sbbots » Feb 11, 2014 7:11 pm

MaartenK wrote:The option "last full backup to tape" would be the best :wink:. Hope Veeam will consider this option in a feature release
And hopefully "Only most recent vbk file" from a backup repository for "Files to Tape" jobs. I have a script that does this in a round-about way but built-in functionality wouldn't hurt. One can dream of a brighter, less-scripted future :wink:

v.eremin
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Re: Backup to Tape only last backup with reversed incrementa

Post by v.eremin » Feb 12, 2014 9:03 am

Hi, Matt,

You mean sometimes it happens that there are more than two full backups in given directory that haven't been copied yet to tape mediums by file to tape job, and you want to copy only the latest file, right?

Thanks.

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