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DaveBristolIT
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by DaveBristolIT » Mar 30, 2015 11:08 am

Gostev wrote:So using CBT in this scenario would result in bad backups.
Hmmm... 5 years later and I read this - I've got many places that are backing up replicas, to move the whole backup process offsite. Please tell me that Veeam actually knows that it can't use CBT and just disables it? I'm fine with that, I'm just not fine with the wording: "Bad Backups"

*Edit: Just re-read the whole thread, looks like in 6.1 you guys automatically disable CBT which is fine :) I just never like the word "Bad Backups"

severson_bnc
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by severson_bnc » Mar 31, 2015 6:30 pm

Okay, I've got backup proxies up the wazoo and everything has been running since the weekend.

Here's a new screenshot of the replica backup job: http://i.imgur.com/tRbzniz.png. This is an forever incremental job and the screenshot here would be the third run since this weekend in this configuration.

CBT was disabled on another replica, the message reporting that the CBT data was invalid, but this shows this replica VMDK getting siphoned off with CBT enabled.

Anything else you guys recommend I look at, or is this enough confirmation that this might be working now in VS5.5+Veaam8?

severson_bnc
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by severson_bnc » Mar 31, 2015 6:44 pm

Okay, so something very interesting.

Despite the [CBT] tag showing in the replica job, I inspected the VM configuration file and found CTK was set to false for each of the VMs.

Further research on the VMware side found this particular KB article: http://kb.vmware.com/selfservice/micros ... Id=1020128
In it, it stipulates that CBT works when enabled with 0 snapshots, but the implication is that subsequent snapshots would leave CBT enabled.

I imagine then, this just means that for Veeam to use CBT on replica's, it's a matter of changing how the replica is first created so that CBT is enabled while there are no snaps. Thoughts?

tsightler
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by tsightler » Mar 31, 2015 11:26 pm

It's 100% obvious that CBT is not working in your screenshots. If CBT was working then the amount read would not be almost exactly equal to the amount processed as that's the entire point of CBT, to only require reading the changed blocks. Those screenshots are definitely of a system running "snap and scan" backups, which is what Veeam used prior to CBT, effectively Veeam takes a snapshot and scans the entire disk transfering only non-duplicate blocks. That's definitely what is happening in your screenshot.

And this is exactly as it should be if you are backing up replicas. This is simply due to the way CBT works on VMware. The process responsible for updating the CTK files (the file that actually contains the data used by CBT) is the VMX process for the running VM. If you think about this you can already see the problem, a replica is not powered on so there is no VMX process, thus nothing is actually tracking CBT data and updating the CTK data. As far as I know there is no method to make this work even with vSphere 5.5 due to this architectural limitation.

Vitaliy S.
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by Vitaliy S. » Apr 01, 2015 12:07 pm

severson_bnc wrote:CBT was disabled on another replica, the message reporting that the CBT data was invalid, but this shows this replica VMDK getting siphoned off with CBT enabled.
Yes, this message should be observed on the incremental run of the backup jobs targeted to replicas.

thavener
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by thavener » Apr 09, 2015 7:23 pm

Really wish this was a built in option.

Maybe setup a second schedule in the replication job to run a backup and prevent the replication from running during that time.

tsightler
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by tsightler » Apr 10, 2015 2:09 am

We do have replicate from backup. If you want your backups offsite where your replicas are you can always run the backup directly to offsite repository and then update the replica from the backup data. The end result is the same, i.e. backups and replicas offsite from a single source pass, the only difference is the backups happen first, then the replicas are updated, instead of the other way around. Yes it might not be exactly what you want, but it's something we have available now.

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[MERGED] backup from replica virtual machines

Post by jaredondo » May 20, 2015 3:38 pm

is it posible (supported) to make a backup from replica virtual machines???

foggy
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by foggy » May 20, 2015 3:45 pm

Backing up a replica is supported, however has some limitations, which are covered in the topic above. Thanks.

jeancharles
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by jeancharles » May 21, 2015 2:05 pm

Hello,

I would like to go on with this discussion and ask a question about a best practice over WAN link.

Can I made replicas onsite, backups onsite note from replicas but from VMs, and make replicas offiste over WAN link with WAN Accelerator and then backup the VM replicas offsite?

I read some limitations are ongoing, but in vSphere 5.5 and VEEAM 8p2 what can we see like problems other than those?

- CBT not working for offsite backups from replicas?
- Problems with scheduling when a backup occurs over a replication job result in CBT failure

My main goal is evidently to send the least possible data over the WAN link and have a replica and backups offsite for the same "price" :)

Thank you for your answers that will make a nice sum up for people arriving on this topic.

foggy
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by foggy » May 21, 2015 2:23 pm

jeancharles wrote:My main goal is evidently to send the least possible data over the WAN link and have a replica and backups offsite for the same "price" :)
Remember, with Veeam B&R v8 you can do replicas from backup to achieve that goal.

jeancharles
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by jeancharles » May 21, 2015 2:42 pm

You are so right I totally forgot that...

So I can send Backups over the WAN then create replicas from them, and safely ignore most of the points I listed as eventual problems.

That is a great way to achieve 3-2-1, I will have a copy and a replica local, a copy offsite then a replica offsite too :)

jadams159
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[MERGED] Create a backup from a replica?

Post by jadams159 » Aug 21, 2015 8:40 pm

I know we can create replicas from backup files, but does anyone know of a way to create a backup from a replicated VM?

foggy
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Re: Backup the replicated VMs

Post by foggy » Aug 21, 2015 9:57 pm

Justin, nothing special, you can back replicas up, just keep in mind the limitations discussed in the thread above.

Saad
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[MERGED] : Backup From replicated Environment

Post by Saad » Nov 10, 2015 6:23 pm

Hello
I'm thinking of switching Veeam backup jobs to run on the replicated vms instead of production vms , but i got a couple of questions before i do that

1. do i need to buy extra licenses for the other hosts that are holding the replicated vms ?
2. any down side of doing that for replication jobs ? i heard that there was an CBT issue " i haven't looked at it yet"

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