more readable graphics, colors and icons, wow much impressive

[ml35]

https://www.veeam.com/veeam_agent_windo ... new_wn.pdf says:

Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows v5
What’s new in v5?
[...]
Refreshed Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows UI with more readable graphics, colors and icons.

I don't understand how "more readable graphics, colors and icons" are prioritized over:

- ability to exclude certain paths in "entire computer" mode without manually externally editing the registry
- putting a simple text explaining in "entire computer" choice that Outlook cached data is going to be lost on restore because it is never backed up in the first place
- able to auto-start and auto-stop just before and after a backup run the resource hog service "Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows" and the child MSSQL instance that is trashing the cpu all the time without being used by veeam

[ml35]

can't edit but i'll add also:
- fixing "Failed to compact full backup file Details: Exception of type 'Veeam.Backup.AgentProvider.AgentClosedException' was thrown. "

[Natalia Lupacheva]

Hello,

thank you for bringing together the feature requests which are important for you.
As far as I see there is a separate thread for each of them, and your request is already counted as +1.

Please keep in mind that each feature request has its own complexity and the time that would be taken to realize each feature depends on a lot of factors.
So please stay tuned and thank you for bringing your issues and your feedback.

Thank you!

[Dima P.]

ml35,

Thanks for your feedback. UI improvements require very minor resourses from RnD team, so we were able to add those very last minute.

- ability to exclude certain paths in "entire computer" mode without manually externally editing the registry

You can do that today without any registry hacks. Go to file level backup mode, keep all the volumes checked and uncheck the folder you want to exclude under the specific volume (you need to make sure that label neat the volume states 'volume level backup').

- putting a simple text explaining in "entire computer" choice that Outlook cached data is going to be lost on restore because it is never backed up in the first place

Text explains that temp files will be excluded. I'll make sure that we have the detailed explanation in the User Guide, thank you.

- able to auto-start and auto-stop just before and after a backup run the resource hog service "Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows" and the child MSSQL instance that is trashing the cpu all the time without being used by veeam

That is a workaround, we are working on a better approach for the next version.

- fixing "Failed to compact full backup file Details: Exception of type 'Veeam.Backup.AgentProvider.AgentClosedException' was thrown. "

To be honest this one sounds like a bug or infrastructure specific issue, do you have any case id to share?

[ml35]

You can do that today without any registry hacks. Go to file level backup mode, keep all the volumes checked and uncheck the folder you want to exclude under the specific volume (you need to make sure that label neat the volume states 'volume level backup').

Once I do that, does it remember to exclude in "Entire computer" mode?
Because if not, not only these are wrong instructions but also wasted time attempting to follow them, since I stated "entire computer" mode, not any other mode.

To be honest this one sounds like a bug or infrastructure specific issue, do you have any case id to share?

I've submitted #04755947. Note this is the second time this is happening, first time I've simply given up the old backups and started a new chain, but now happening a second time it's really frustrating so I've filed the support case.

[ml35]

Text explains that temp files will be excluded. I'll make sure that we have the detailed explanation in the User Guide, thank you.

Until the user reads the user guide, the first place where he meets the incomplete and misleading information is the app user interface. I already suggested an easy to implement improvement to the UI more than one year ago, but it seems to be completely ignored. I'll quote myself from that post: The wording says "deleted, temporary and page files", but Outlook .OST file IS NOT TEMPORARY. It IS a cached file indeed, but is a persistent permanent file!

Here is a second attempt, literally all you have to to is add few more words in the source project. There is absolutely nothing that prevents you from doing that right away:
Before:


After:

[Gostev]

I don't understand how "more readable graphics, colors and icons" are prioritized over:
- ability to exclude certain paths in "entire computer" mode without manually externally editing the registry
- putting a simple text explaining in "entire computer" choice that Outlook cached data is going to be lost on restore because it is never backed up in the first place
- able to auto-start and auto-stop just before and after a backup run the resource hog service "Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows" and the child MSSQL instance that is trashing the cpu all the time without being used by veeam

Graphics, colors and icons are done by designers. You can't be serious expecting graphic designers to work on implementing the features you listed instead?

[Gostev]

Here is a second attempt, literally all you have to to is add few more words in the source project. There is absolutely nothing that prevents you from doing that right away:
After:

Sorry, but this is not going to happen on my watch: we won't put a User Guide page into a User Interface. Technical documentation exists for a reason, and users are expected to consult it before using the product.

[ml35]

Sorry, but this is not going to happen on my watch: we won't put a User Guide page into a User Interface. Technical documentation exists for a reason, and users are expected to consult it before using the product.

Then at least fix the LIES you tell to the user in the UI!!! OUTLOOK CACHED OST FILE IS NOT A TEMPORARY FILE IT STAYS THERE EVEN WHEN OUTLOOK IS CLOSED, IT STAYS THERE FOR THE WHOLE DURATION OF AN ACCOUNT BEING ADDED TO OUTLOOK

[ml35]

this is aggravated by the fact that you make "entire computer" the default selected option and the "recommended" method.

you literally are driving people to lose data when they choose Veeam over other solutions that do not silently and misleadingly exclude their cached outlook file(s)!

[Gostev]

Sorry, but you are completely wrong here: people do not "loose data" because the cached OST file is nothing but a cache of data which is stored on the Exchange server. And just like any other cache, it will be re-populated if missing.

Also, you're missing the fact that it is not a Veeam functionality to "silently and misleadingly exclude cached outlook files", but rather how Microsoft decided to implement their VSS snapshots. Thus, any backup vendor that performs hot backup in the only way that is officially supported by Microsoft - through the VSS framework - will have the same "issue".

[Mildur]

you literally are driving people to lose data when they choose Veeam over other solutions that do not silently and misleadingly exclude their cached outlook file(s)!

I choose Veeam to backup my Mail Data on the source.
Exchange Server with VBR/Agent or Exchange Online with VBO365.

Cache Files are not data files. Cache files are junk and dispensable.

[ml35]

Sorry, but you are completely wrong here: people do not "loose data" because the cached OST file is nothing but a cache of data which is stored on the Exchange server. And just like any other cache, it will be re-populated if missing.

it is a cache, but it is NOT temporary! How can you keep making false statements when your software says "deleted, temporary and page files". A CACHED FILE IS NOT A TEMPORARY FILE. even if it is populated, this consumes resources (both server, client and network) to repopulate!

Also, you're missing the fact that it is not a Veeam functionality to "silently and misleadingly exclude cached outlook files", but rather how Microsoft decided to implement their VSS snapshots. Thus, any backup vendor that performs hot backup in the only way that is officially supported by Microsoft - through the VSS framework - will have the same "issue".

BUT YOU STATE RIGHT THERE IN THE APP THAT ONLY TEMPORARY, DELETED AND PAGE FILES would be excluded, WHICH IS A OUTFRONT LIE

[ml35]

Cache files are junk and dispensable.

oh really? tell that to my friend who managed to save his one week worth of work emails because of exchange crash and admin had to restore to a working version from 7 days ago!

[Mildur]

Then tell your friend, why your admin doesn‘t have a backup which is working for the exchange. 7 days of dataloss is huge for a mailserver.
The main responsible of a backup admin is to make sure of RPO/RTO. And to test the backups. What is the purpose of a backup from exchange server, which is not restorable. The cache data is not the Solution for not having a working backup.

[Gostev]

BUT YOU STATE RIGHT THERE IN THE APP THAT ONLY TEMPORARY, DELETED AND PAGE FILES would be excluded, WHICH IS A OUTFRONT LIE

Actually, it is the perfectly correct statement and I don't see a single false word in it. The exclusion of the above-mentioned files is our proprietary functionality, which is why we're documenting it right there in the user interface, as most of this is exclusive to Veeam and cannot be found in other image-based Windows backup applications.

It is true that we're not documenting directly in our user interface information that is not specific to our product, particularly any peculiarities of the Microsoft VSS framework, or Microsoft Windows itself. Just like my microwave oven does not have a label next to the Start button saying that I should not be using it to dry house animals. This kind of stuff is for manuals, not for user interfaces.

I believe the original question of this thread has been fully answered, and further everyone has made their points regarding the perceived "data loss" and lack of UI labels about the Microsoft VSS framework design. So I'm locking this thread now to finish the Caps Lock discussion about nothing