NetApp SnapDiff V3

[MrDude]

Is veeam supporting netapp snapdiff v3?

[rennerstefan]

short answer is: no
snapdiff v3 doesn't allow any partner to use it for external backup or data.

[Gostev]

Integration with snapdiff was actually the first Changed File Tracking API integration we developed for our NAS Backup functionality but NetApp then blocked vendors from using it (legal block) and we had to disable it in the code. But we can easily enable it back if they ever change their mind

[MrDude]

I was listening to a podcast min 17m:28s is where he starts talking about snapdiff v3. I`m a little unsure cause NetApp Product team on the pod says that they do allow partners access to the API so that they can update their code, but on the other hand partners like Veeam say that they "blocked" access? Can you help me to understand what is actually the issue here?

podcast link: https://whyistheinternetbroken.wordpres ... -snapdiff/

[Gostev]

This podcast is from almost 3 years ago. There were not any restrictions back then, which is why we invested our R&D resources into Snapdiff integration but later NetApp suddenly had a change of heart, or of management, or both (don't remember already except that they had some rough times).

The issue is that NetApp doesn't want backup vendors to be able to use this API outside of the NetApp world. Think of it as a creative way to force vendor lock-in. In other words, when using this API, backup vendors are only allowed to backup from NetApp to NetApp. @rennerstefan is my understanding this correct?

[rennerstefan]

Almost 100% right.
Back then it was still snapdiff v2 which had different rules.
But with snapdiff v3 which replace v2 it is essentially what you wrote.
Partner are allowed to use it to orchestrate Snapshot based backup that stay within the NetApp world, but it’s not allowed to use it for “external” backup like what we would do to a veeam repo.
Hope that clarifies things.

Btw, the way we do NAS backup and how we detect changed items is pretty smart.

[Gostev]

Good point, actually there are scenarios where our approach identifies changes faster than a snapdiff API call processing takes. Having said that, of course it would be lovely to be able to use Snapdiff as it delivers more consistent performance overall.

[TonyLu]

Hi Sir,
As we know some competitor (Cohesity, Commvault and Veritas Netbackup) say they got approved to support NetApp SnapDiff v3 REST API . Would we get approve? Any roadmap?

[rennerstefan]

Hi,

Please details what they get approved for? As mentioned in this thread it’s not about if it can be used but what use cases it can be used for. And the restriction that it can only be used when data stays within Netapp’s technologies, specifically using their replication and snapshot technologies, doesn’t help us as we would use it to pull data out as a backup.

Can you in addition specify where you think snapdiff would help compared to our current way of NAS backup?

Thanks

[TonyLu]

Hi Sir,

1. First, Because Customer using a lot of NetApp NAS storages device. And they want to backup their NAS more faster, so they are ask backup vendor should support snapdiff v3 to get better performance.

2. If we are not plan to support SnapDiff v3, How we prove our NAS backup is batter than those support SnapDiff API solution ?

3. Did we support SnapDiff v1 or v2 for NAS backup?

Regards,
Tony

[rennerstefan]

1) and 2) ok thanks. Did you run any PoC with the customer yet to see how our NAS engine works. If yes where was the performance bottleneck as you say they expect better performance.

3) see above in this thread:

Integration with snapdiff was actually the first Changed File Tracking API integration we developed for our NAS Backup functionality but NetApp then blocked vendors from using it (legal block) and we had to disable it in the code. But we can easily enable it back if they ever change their mind

[erbruening]

Hi Stefan,

do you have an update regarding the legal block from NetApp?
Is the block still active?

Kind Regards
Eric

[rennerstefan]

Hi,

There is no update as of now.

Thanks

[navion]

Any updates? IBM just got support for SnapDiff V3 in the latest update.

[rennerstefan]

Hi,

there is no update other than that we actively talk with NetApp about the situation.

Thanks

[KarmaKuma]

Any update on this?

[rennerstefan]

Indeed there will be an update very soon... make sure you follow our upcoming releases.

[KarmaKuma]

Popcorn's already in the microwave

[rennerstefan]

Now that we shipped 12.3 we can tell, that it includes SnapDiff v1 support. So everyone can use it as planned.
We are also planning to switch to SnapDiff v3, which, besides being a different API type (REST vs. ZAPI), has only minor differences.
But the good new is you can use it now.
Thanks

[hayliz]

@rennerstefan thank you for the good news. Is there a timetable for when it might be supported with v3?
Thanks

[rennerstefan]

Nothing I can share at this point.
Just out of interest why do you need specifically v3? because of FlexGroup support?

[hayliz]

@rennerstefan
thank you very much for your quick response. Exactly, the FlexGroup thing would be important here. Furthermore nfs, cifs, snapshots list, content list, recovery of snapshots on file level and rest API etc. included. If v2 can do everything that v3 can do and continues to do in all ontaps then no matter.

[rennerstefan]

thanks for the feedback. as said there are plans and as done this time I will share an update as soon as we can share it.

[andreas_1985]

Great that Veeam now supports SnappDiff. I hope that SnappDiff v3 will soon be supported by Veeam. ZAPI, which is used by Snappdiff v1, is unfortunately deprecated and could probably be removed from Ontap in the future.

[hbardowicks]

Great News there is progress in this matter.

https://community.netapp.com/t5/blogs/b ... cle-id/513

Hopefully this goes beyond SnapDiff V1