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grantd
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Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by grantd »

The page below shows that Veeam currently supports failover clusters, but not ones that use cluster shared volumes. Are there any plans to implement that capability? Testing shows that backing up a CSV on a file share cluster currently works (at least in our test environment) but simply isn't officially supported by Veeam. Thanks.

https://helpcenter.veeam.com/docs/backu ... tml?ver=95

Dima P.
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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Hello and welcome to the community grantd.

Indeed, CSV is not supported. Please clarify what type of data you store on the CSV? Thank you!

grantd
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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by grantd »

Thanks. I'm specifically looking to backup a Windows DFS File Share that currently uses CSVs.

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by sbiggi »

I have a customer running Windows Failover Cluster with SQL 2014 using CSVs and the databases reside on the CSV. So as Veeam currently is, it doesn't backup any database information.

If Veeam can backup HyperV using CSVs, why doesn't it support it for non-hyperv backups?

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Hello Seth.

The processing logic is different, so this request cannot be implemented that easy. Thanks for sharing your use case, I've added your vote to this feature request.

CorbinD
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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by CorbinD »

So, Does Veeam have a best practice then or option for backing up shared cluster storage?

Thx,

T

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Terry,

Please clarify when saying clustered storage are you referring to cluster shared volumes? Thank you.

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by CorbinD »

Hi Dima,

Yes, Clustered shared volumes.

T

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by rolflobker »

I am also interested in this.

For High Availability it makes sense to use Cluster Shared Volumes for fileshares.
This also enables to option of Rolling Upgrades without downtime.

So my use case would not specifically be backing up the CSV itself, rather the Cluster Role(s)
The Clustered disk / Shares. Those can 'migrate' from server A to server B.

This effectively "removes" the Clustered Disk and shares from the VM itself so I would understand that this requires an alternative method of back-ing up because it cannot be linked to a specific VM.

Maybe Clustered disks could be backed up to a seperate VBR/VBK that is linked to all the VM's that have this cluster role?

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Hi folks,

Sorry for keeping silence. From the top of my head the workaround for csv backup might be file level approach i.e. file copy or even file to tape job aimed at CSV volume via SMB.

himcrucified
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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by himcrucified »

I would definitely REALLY appreciate support for CSV backup support (file shares).

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Hello and welcome to the community Jacob,

Just to clarify, are you saying that in your environment csv is mostly used as a storage for your file servers? Would it be ok to back them up on a file level instead of volume level? Thanks!

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by himcrucified »

Dima, yes we're looking at using CSV's exclusively. And yes, it would be okay in the short-term to back them up on a file level for now. I've been trying to do this but I must be doing something wrong, is there someone in support who could help me?

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Jacob,

Unfortunately it's not possible to protect CSV via agent or VM backup now.

Potential workaround might be to use file to tape job: provide access to the desired files via smb and use file to tape job with these files as a source (tape library is not required as you can use virtual tape library). Cheers!

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by himcrucified »

I don't need it to "support" a CSV just need it to treat it like any other drive/volume so that I can do a file level backup. I was told that this might work. Is this what you mean by using a virtual tape library? If so, I'm not familiar with that type of job, can you elaborate?

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Jacob,

There is no way to process files from csv even with file level backup mode (as snapshot of the volume is required anyway). My idea was around file to tape job as it can backup files from smb file share to emulated tape drive. That might sound like an overkill (as you have to setup additional components and backup activities - tape jobs and virtual tape library), but such workaround is completely free as it does not require any licensing: vtl like Quadstor is free and file to tape job is available in community edition of Veeam B&R. Last does not require license as well.

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by jotge »

Dima P. wrote:
Apr 27, 2018 10:54 am
Hello Seth.

The processing logic is different, so this request cannot be implemented that easy. Thanks for sharing your use case, I've added your vote to this feature request.
Hello Dima,

any news about the feature request status?

We are working in environments of serveral customers with microsoft failover cluster and cluster shared volumes to provide sql server instances. At the moment we use sql maintanence plans as a workaround to backup the databases full and the transaction logs to another servers share. After that we do a backup of this server with a agent- or agentless backup. But this can be just a workaround!

Now back to your post from Apr 27 last year. Is there any news about developing or better releasing this feature.

Thank's

Dima P.
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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Hello and welcome to the community jotge.

Unfortunately I do not have any updates to share now.

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by marinu »

Hello everybody
I`m also interested in Backup a CSV... Are there news?

Ciao, Mario

Dima P.
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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

Hello Mario,

Thank you for updating this thread with your feature request! CSV support is not planned for the next major version but we keep tracking this feature request very attentively.

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by jayscarff »

Just confirming, we've got a SQL cluster, using cluster shared volumes for the DBs and logs, these are vms on hyper v. Are you saying that the SQL will not be backed up??
Jason
VMCE v9

Dima P.
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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by Dima P. »

No, this thread is related to Veeam Agent for Windows / Agent Management functionality. Hyper-V backup works fine.

heavy
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[MERGED] Best-Practice for SQL-CLuster with CSV

Post by heavy »

Hi all,

just came across the limitation "no CSV support for failover clusters".
https://helpcenter.veeam.com/docs/backu ... ml?ver=100
As i need to come up with a recommendation (or even better - a solution) for a customer, i hope to get some input on what is considered best practice and how others deal with it.

Scenario as follows:
Customer implemented a rather complex Veeam environment with dozens of locations, several hundred VMs and quite few other Agent-protected machines. With Veeam 10 we finally move NFS-Share Backups to Veeam. Customer is very satisfied with Veeams functionality and usability.
Now there's just two systems left that are stilled backed up by the old backup solution: both being physical SQL-clusters serving a pretty large Sharepoint environment.

So I've been searching the forums quite a bit and read some blog posts and articles.
veeam-agent-for-windows-f33/sql-failove ... 62947.html
veeam-backup-replication-f2/resiliant-s ... 63983.html
https://www.veeam.com/blog/windows-serv ... uster.html
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/window ... uster-csvs
https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/ ... a-p/371962

So, from what i understand, Veeam's persperctive is that cluster-shared-volumes are to be used in Hyper-V envrionments, not SQL.
As far as i understand Microsoft (and DBAs for that matter), cluster-shared-volumes are the way to go in modern SQL-Clusters - fast failover alone is probably the most valuable argument.

If it was my system, i'd totally change the existing cluster into an AlwaysOn-Availability-Group - problem solved.
Unfortunately, the customer is not willing to change the running system which i totally understand.
My first reaction was: just use native SQL backups and dump them to some SMB-Share, Veeam can take care of the rest. Customer: "are we back in 1995?" Actually i couldn't come up with a good reply.

So guys, help me out here. Anyone else been in that situation?
Anyone using CSVs for their SQL-Servers? What's your backup-strategy?
Does anyone have better arguments for re-doing the clusters without CSVs or using AlwaysOn-AGs?

Thanks
Thomas

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by HannesK »

Hello Thomas,
I merged your question to the existing thread.

You already mentioned all possibilities. Nothing to add from Veeam side as CSV backups are currently not supported with Veeam Agent for Windows.

Best regards,
Hannes

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by heavy »

Hi Hannes,

I was hoping for some user-experience that's why I created the separate thread. I'm not too confident anyone will find their way to this thread to share some ideas.

Are there any plans to support CSVs in future Veaam releases?

Regards
Thomas

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by HannesK »

Hello Thomas,
there are always plans to improve our product... so take your request as heard, but I cannot provide any timeline yet.

Best regards,
Hannes

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Re: Windows Cluster Shared Volumes Support

Post by rennerstefan »

Hi team,

adding also my +1 for the request to add CSV support for SQL soon.
There qay too many customers in the field today still using or even implementing new SQL Cluster with CSV instead of Availability Groups
Today there is, as you mentioned Hannes, no answer from Veeam which is in lots of cases an issue as we need to either sell a different product just for SQL backup or the customer stops the veeam project as SQL is most of the time a core component in the environments.

Right now I have 3 deals with the same issue, most of the with > 200 VUL needs.

Thanks
Stefan Renner
Solution Architect, Bechtle

VMware vExpert, VCP
NetApp United Member, NCIE & NCDA, Cisco Champion
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