Discussions specific to tape backups
Post Reply
jbrullemans
Enthusiast
Posts: 41
Liked: 1 time
Joined: Mar 09, 2011 8:22 am
Full Name: John Brullemans
Contact:

Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by jbrullemans » Oct 26, 2017 7:26 am

Hi,

Because of the increase of ransomware around the world the only way to have a complete offline backup is in mine opion still a tape solution. Backup to the cloud can still be compromised if credentails are cracked.
Currently our backup jobs are forward incremental with active full on saturday.
So what i would to achieve is that on working days a the full backup chain (or virtual full) is backupped to the tape streamer. So on monday it is the Full of sa with incrementals of su-mo. on tuesday it is : full of saturday and incrementals of su-mo-tu etc. etc.

Does anyone know how to configure this? i tried virtual full on every day but that doesn't seem to work. I don't want to backup only the incremenals because in case of a disaster this could result in using 6 tapes to restore.

The physical setup for this will be : local server with 12 or more hd spindels with local attached VTL LTO7.

v.Eremin
Veeam Software
Posts: 15221
Liked: 1146 times
Joined: Oct 26, 2012 3:28 pm
Full Name: Vladimir Eremin
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by v.Eremin » Oct 26, 2017 11:56 am

i tried virtual full on every day but that doesn't seem to work
What specific issues you encountered with daily virtual full backup? What backup mode does a source backup job use?

jbrullemans
Enthusiast
Posts: 41
Liked: 1 time
Joined: Mar 09, 2011 8:22 am
Full Name: John Brullemans
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by jbrullemans » Oct 26, 2017 12:41 pm

Hi,
The problem with daily virtual full is that is doesn't do a daily full it just writes the incremental to tape.
The source backup mode is forward incremental with active full on saturday.

v.Eremin
Veeam Software
Posts: 15221
Liked: 1146 times
Joined: Oct 26, 2012 3:28 pm
Full Name: Vladimir Eremin
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by v.Eremin » Oct 26, 2017 1:05 pm

Try to switch:

1) Either to reversed incremental mode
2) Or to forward forever incremental and daily virtual full backup

This way, the .vbk file will be copied or created on tapes on everyday basis.

Thanks.

jbrullemans
Enthusiast
Posts: 41
Liked: 1 time
Joined: Mar 09, 2011 8:22 am
Full Name: John Brullemans
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by jbrullemans » Oct 26, 2017 1:11 pm

Hi Eremin,

That is exactly what i don't want. Revesere incremental is to slow.
but forward forever you mean? don't do active or synthetic full and use virtual full for tape? Aint there another way? forever incremental is a little bit scary i think beause the you never reset the backup chain.
John

v.Eremin
Veeam Software
Posts: 15221
Liked: 1146 times
Joined: Oct 26, 2012 3:28 pm
Full Name: Vladimir Eremin
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by v.Eremin » Oct 26, 2017 4:16 pm

don't do active or synthetic full and use virtual full for tape?
Correct.
Aint there another way?
I doubt that you will manage to copy full backup daily with any other approach.
forever incremental is a little bit scary i think beause the you never reset the backup chain.
With periodic SureBackup and health checks, you should be OK.

Thanks.

lyapkost
Veeam Software
Posts: 136
Liked: 17 times
Joined: Nov 27, 2015 2:26 pm
Full Name: Konstantin
Location: Saint Petersburg
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by lyapkost » Oct 27, 2017 7:40 am

jbrullemans wrote:Aint there another way?
Hi John. If a source job is forward incremental with periodic fulls enabled the tape job won't write synthetic fulls. That's by design (see note).

As a trick you may try to use in the tape job a pre-job powershell script which disables synthetic fulls in the source job and a post-job script which enables them again.

hwelvaar
Novice
Posts: 5
Liked: never
Joined: Feb 08, 2018 1:58 pm
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by hwelvaar » Jul 11, 2018 9:32 am

Where or how can I submit a feature request ?

As described above, backup to tape (offline storage) is the only way to be 100% sure that hackers won't be able to destroy or encrypt all your data.

I too need a full backup to tape every single day, but still want to use incremental backup for the preceeding backup-to-disk job.

Yes I know reverse incremental exists, but it is slow, and available only for VM's. I also use Veeam agent for a number of physical servers, and reverse incremental is not available for agent based backups.

I mean how stupid is it, that if you do periodic active or synthetic full to disk, as a result you cannot do virtual full to tape. ????

v.Eremin
Veeam Software
Posts: 15221
Liked: 1146 times
Joined: Oct 26, 2012 3:28 pm
Full Name: Vladimir Eremin
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by v.Eremin » Jul 11, 2018 12:17 pm

Where or how can I submit a feature request ?
You've already done it by posting here.
I mean how stupid is it, that if you do periodic active or synthetic full to disk, as a result you cannot do virtual full to tape. ????
It's not, if you think about the idea or the use case behind tape virtual full backup. The idea is simple - to allow users to back up forward forever incremental chains.

Thanks.

wolfgang
Novice
Posts: 4
Liked: never
Joined: Feb 10, 2016 12:05 pm
Full Name: Wolfgang Voigt
Contact:

Re: Backup to Tape always FULL

Post by wolfgang » Oct 26, 2018 11:54 am

Hi together,
I'm facing the same problem.
I want to do daily full backups to tape and I also have virtual and physical backups(via agent).

Now after a few mails with the support it seems there is maybe a solution for this (for me also stupid) problem.
I need to do active fulls once a month because my company told me to do that.
Reverse increments are not available for physical backups so there is no option to only backup ONE restore point to tape (daily).

More funny that if you run a active full manually via the GUI the virtual full is created by the tape-job as described in this article:
If the source backup chain contains a full backup that was created on the virtual full day (for example, an active full backup created manually), the tape job will copy it and will not create a virtual full.
Source: https://helpcenter.veeam.com/docs/backu ... tml?ver=95

The support told me, that on the next tape-backup the active full will be used as basis for the next virtual full.

I can understand that it makes sense for forever incremental chains. But a simple additional checkbox in the tape backup "do a virtual full, even if an active/synthetic full is scheduled" would resolve the problem.
Because technically it doesn't seem to be a problem if a manually executed backup does not stop the tape-backup-job from creating a virtual fulls.

Now my Idea how to workaround that:
Create forever incremental chain without any planned fulls.
Create a windows task which calls Veeam via API/Powershell to create a manual active full (or synthetic) monthly.
I need to try this, but for my understanding it is exactly what I and (I'm sure many) other customers want.

Active fulls + daily full backup to tape.
I will try this out and give a update here, maybe this helps others.

Regards
Wolfgang

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests