Discussions specific to tape backups
Dima P.
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by Dima P. » Sep 19, 2014 2:40 pm

Hello,

You vote counted, but could you please elaborate your configuration and backup to tape scenario, this would provide better understanding and possibly force the implementation of this feature. Thank you.

BDietrich
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by BDietrich » Sep 19, 2014 3:21 pm

Configuration/situation:
VMware Cluster with around 25 VMs including Exchange, SQL and Fileserver. Overall space requirement: 2,7TB and rising
Dedicated Backupserver with 6TB harddisk space an two tape drives: 1x LTO5 (1.4TB native) and 1x LTO6 (2.5TB native)

Imagine a nice Friday full backup....
The wish:
To have an unattended full backup2disk2tape I would backup my cluster to disk, dump it to the LTO6 and after that tape is full veeam continues the copy job on the second tape in the LTO5 drive. The next morning I have 2 tapes ejected that contain my full backup.

The reality:
I make a complete backup2disk and after that the copy to tape begins on my LTO6 drive. After the tape is full it get's ejected and veeam waits for another tape in the LTO6 drive to continue. So I have the choice of swapping tapes on my precious weeked or finish my backup sometime on monday.

Steve_za
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by Steve_za » Sep 22, 2014 6:22 am

The way I've worked around this is to split the backups to the different tape drives, not ideal as my SQL server varies from 100gb to 500gb incrementals so I need to leave a lot of wiggle room, which sometime pushes me over to 3 tapes, but it is working for now.

Cheers
Steve

v.eremin
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by v.eremin » Sep 22, 2014 8:02 am

Yes, for now a workable solution might be to split existing backup job into several ones, create backup to tape jobs (one per backup job), point them to different media pools that are created for different drives. This way, the multiple drives will be used simultaneously, and capacity of one medium should be enough to host backups created by smaller backup job.

Thanks.

BDietrich
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by BDietrich » Sep 22, 2014 1:57 pm

Of course the splitting is a "patch" until veeam has a real solution. But if you rely on a tape saving B2D2T with incrementals during weekdays you run into the next problem of veeam: No incrementals only. So the downside of the splitting solution is a doubled amount of disk space to hold your (split) full and incremental (which ALSO includes a full backup! hence the doubling) backups/restorepoints.
This is a vicious circle in which you burn your disk storage and increase the complexity of your backup tapes.

Please veeam developers: enable the consolidation of media pools across independent tape drives!

BDietrich
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by BDietrich » Sep 22, 2014 2:13 pm

Same topic, other problem I just encountered (or I'm too blind to see):
If you have two (or more) tape drives and the backup job with incrementals demands a new tape you can not distinguish which drive is asking for a tape. Is it the weekly full backup the incremental strategy presumes (which goes to the LTO6 in my case) or does it want a tape for the incrementals (which goes to the LTO5).
This is not as self explaining as the rest of this nice backup software is.
Please add details to the "WaitingTape"-status.
Thanks!

v.eremin
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by v.eremin » Sep 23, 2014 8:19 am

BDietrich wrote:So the downside of the splitting solution is a doubled amount of disk space to hold your (split) full and incremental (which ALSO includes a full backup! hence the doubling) backups/restorepoints.
Not sure why you're talking about doubling disk space. Splitting a big backup job into smaller chunks would result in smaller increments and fulls created. So, the disk consumption should stay more or less the same.
BDietrich wrote: Is it the weekly full backup the incremental strategy presumes (which goes to the LTO6 in my case) or does it want a tape for the incrementals (which goes to the LTO5).Please add details to the "WaitingTape"-status.
I'm wondering whether that situation can be avoided by giving meaningful names to tape jobs, something like "weekly full - LTO 6", "incremental - LTO 5".

Thanks.

v.eremin
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by v.eremin » Sep 23, 2014 8:27 am

BDietrich wrote:Of course the splitting is a "patch" until veeam has a real solution. But if you rely on a tape saving B2D2T with incrementals during weekdays you run into the next problem of veeam: No incrementals only.
As I've just mentioned in the adjacent thread, you can copy only increments with the help of file to tape job. Thanks.

Steve_za
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by Steve_za » Sep 26, 2014 6:54 am

I've just run into a new issue, I'm not sure if it is because of the multiple individual tape drives, but when I use different tapes for incrementals, ie, a monday tape, tuesday tape, etc, Veeam does not recognise the tape, presumably because there are incrementals from the previous week on the tape, so it just sit on waiting for tape.
If I move the tape to the free pool, it starts working, but that means all my previous incrementals are lost. I don't see why it can't just use the (1.8TB) free space.
Veeam really needs to get a handle on Tape backups urgently. I love the rest of the software, but tapes are a nightmare

v.eremin
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by v.eremin » Sep 26, 2014 11:08 am

Steve_za wrote:I've just run into a new issue, I'm not sure if it is because of the multiple individual tape drives, but when I use different tapes for incrementals, ie, a monday tape, tuesday tape, etc, Veeam does not recognise the tape, presumably because there are incrementals from the previous week on the tape, so it just sit on waiting for tape.
Most likely the retention period isn't expired yet. What retention settings does the corresponding media pool have? Thanks.

Steve_za
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by Steve_za » Sep 27, 2014 6:01 am

The retention period isn't expired, but that is the point. I still have 1.8tb free, why can't veeam use the free storage instead of trying to overwrite what is there?

v.eremin
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by v.eremin » Sep 27, 2014 12:58 pm

The retention settings are configurable in media pool options. Whether or not data is going to be appended to tape medium is based on those settings. Thanks.

Steve_za
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by Steve_za » Sep 29, 2014 5:08 am

Can you please then tell me what the settings should be, because it is clearly not working as expected.

I've tried setting it to never expire, and expire after 1 month, both settings still do not append the incremental, they try to overwrite it.
So how do I get this to work properly?

v.eremin
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by v.eremin » Sep 29, 2014 7:49 am

Retentions settings are applied to mediasets. So, what media set creation option does the said media pool have? Is it "Create a new media set for every backup session" by any chance? Thanks.

Steve_za
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Re: Question about multiple tape drives

Post by Steve_za » Oct 02, 2014 12:20 pm

No set it to "Do not create" as well and the same issue occurs.
it seems like it might happen after I turn off and on the processing of incrementals in the tape job ( which I have to do due to the way veeam handles vbk and vib files)

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