Full or Synthetic Full?

Availability for the Always-On Enterprise

Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Thu Sep 15, 2016 8:17 pm

Currently I have Veeam 9 set to do forever forward incremental. I back up once a day and have it set for 30 restore points (30 days). My understanding is my first backup was a full followed by incrementals. On the 31st day there will be a transform process where one of the incrementals will get injected into the full and then deleted. This transform process will then happen every day so I will have 30 restore points available.

I am using an Exagrid box as the target for backups. Exagrid's best practice is to set Veeam to do a full or synthetic full backup BEFORE this transform process ever takes place. The Exagrid is not a great device to do the transform on since it would have to drag blocks out of its dedup space, conduct the transform, and then write back to that space.

I am thinking about doing a full or synthetic full every 3 weeks (21 days) so I never trigger this transform on the Exagrid box. Two questions:

1. Do I have all of this correct?
2. If I do have it correct, would you suggest a full or synthetic full?
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby Shestakov » Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:58 am

Hello,
Your understanding is correct.
The choice if to do active full depends on your plan of recoverability checking. If you perform Surebackup you may not need neither active nor synthetic fulls.
Please check this topic for explanation,
Shestakov
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 4850
Liked: 394 times
Joined: Wed May 21, 2014 11:03 am
Location: Saint Petersburg
Full Name: Nikita Shestakov

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Fri Sep 16, 2016 10:16 am

Even with Surebackup, I do not think I can avoid an active or synthetic full. I was told to avoid having the Exagrid box doing the transform process that happens when the number of restore points exceeds the retention policy. I believe the only way to avoid this transform process is to do an active or synthetic full BEFORE the number of restore points exceeds the retention policy. I am leaning towards doing a synthetic full since my Exagrid box is at the other end of a slower link. I believe the synthetic full happens on the Exagrid box so lots of data is not sent across the slow link
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby foggy » Fri Sep 16, 2016 10:43 am

Correct, however synthetic full requires double I/O on the target storage, comparing to active, so I'd decide after testing whether you have enough time to complete it within your backup window. It's less I/O intensive than forever forward, however, all increments are injected on a single day, resulting in much more I/O load.
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 14718
Liked: 1075 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:20 am

Is there any way to have the backup job do an active full once in awhile and the backup copy job do a synthetic full?
I am fairly certain the answer is no since these jobs are really linked. Whatever happens in the backup job is seen by the backup copy job
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby foggy » Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:23 am

Not sure what you're trying to achieve. Backup job and backup copy job are not "linked" in terms of the full backup type, and backup copy job only provides active full functionality (or works as forever incremental otherwise). You can configure them as you want.
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 14718
Liked: 1075 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:33 am

So if I do a synthetic full on my backup job once a week, what happens the next time the backup copy job runs? If I keep 14 days of restore points on the backup copy job, I want to make sure that the transform process never runs on the Exagrid which is the target for the backup copy job
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby foggy » Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:44 am

Ah, so Exagrid is the target for your backup copy job, not the original backup job. Then you do not actually have a choice between active or synthetic full for it, only active full is available. To perform it, you need to enable GFS retention ('Keep the following restore points for archival purposes' check box), configure weekly backups, and enable active full (select the 'Read the entire restore point from source...' check box). This way, backup copy will behave as forward incremental job with periodic active fulls, avoiding any transforms. On the original backup job you can set anything you need, this does not affect backup copy job.
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 14718
Liked: 1075 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:49 am

Let me see if I can phrase this better

I have an Exagrid box that I want to use as the target of a Backup Copy job. This link gives details on Backup Copy job
https://helpcenter.veeam.com/backup/vsp ... _task.html
It appears that a transform process happens for a Backup Copy job if the retention policy on this job is exceeded. Exagrid's best practice is to NEVER run this transform process on their box. Their best practice is to periodically run a synthetic full to avoid this. There is no where on a Backup Copy job to select "Create synthetic full backups periodically". This is only available for Backup jobs. Let's say I set my Backup job to create synthetic fulls once a week. After the synthetic full is complete, what happens the next time the Backup Copy job runs? Will this somehow reset the counter on the number of restore points I have for the Backup Copy job so it DOES NOT exceed the retention set for this job so I never run the transform on the Exagrid?
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby foggy » Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:57 am

HendersonD wrote:After the synthetic full is complete, what happens the next time the Backup Copy job runs?

As I've already mentioned, this doesn't affect the backup copy job. It will perform its usual cycle and copy incremental changes into the new incremental backup file, except the days when GFS active fulls are scheduled at - in this case it will copy the entire VMs data from the source, but this still is not dependent on the original backup job settings.
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 14718
Liked: 1075 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby Shestakov » Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:10 pm

HendersonD,
By default Backup copy job always works in forever forward mode regardless what mode is used for the source backup job(s). Foggy is suggesting a workaround to force backup copy job to use forward incremental mode. Again it doesn`t matter what mode is used for source job.
Thanks!
Shestakov
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 4850
Liked: 394 times
Joined: Wed May 21, 2014 11:03 am
Location: Saint Petersburg
Full Name: Nikita Shestakov

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:27 pm

So there is no way to avoid the transform process happening on the Exagrid box when using it as the target of a Backup Copy job?
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby foggy » Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:29 pm

The way to do it was described above:
foggy wrote:To perform it, you need to enable GFS retention ('Keep the following restore points for archival purposes' check box), configure weekly backups, and enable active full (select the 'Read the entire restore point from source...' check box). This way, backup copy will behave as forward incremental job with periodic active fulls, avoiding any transforms.
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 14718
Liked: 1075 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:08 pm 1 person likes this post

Got it, thanks for all the help
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Re: Full or Synthetic Full?

Veeam Logoby HendersonD » Fri Sep 16, 2016 5:01 pm

I am re-reading through the post and came up with another question. With the Exagrid as the target of the Backup Copy job (not the Backup job), the suggestion was this

Enable GFS retention ('Keep the following restore points for archival purposes' check box), configure weekly backups, and enable active full (select the 'Read the entire restore point from source...' check box). This way, backup copy will behave as forward incremental job with periodic active fulls, avoiding any transforms.

This does avoid the transformation process on the Exagrid but if I am reading this correctly, the "Read the entire restore point from source" will send a large amount of data from my source (Nimble Storage array in my DR site) to the Exagrid. The Exagrid is at my ISP across a 500Mbps connection. Wouldn't sending this amount of data across this connection be problematic? I am backing up about 5TB total.

Perhaps the Exagrid box is just not a good choice for a Backup Copy job offsite?
HendersonD
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 57
Liked: 3 times
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:35 am

Next

Return to Veeam Backup & Replication



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], DonZoomik, foggy, Google [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot], quazer and 50 guests