Comprehensive data protection for all workloads
Post Reply
cag
Enthusiast
Posts: 74
Liked: never
Joined: Mar 26, 2011 4:02 am
Full Name: Conrad Gotzmann
Contact:

Moving VMs to different host

Post by cag » May 08, 2011 1:53 pm

I Just moved one of my VM's from 1 server to another. Running MSSQL / VCenter. Once I did this Veeam Complains that the object cannot be found.
Ok no problem I added the server at its new location. Now the Replication Job complains there are duplicate files.

So whats the problem its the same server with the same destination. Seams to be a BIG DESIGN FLAW that the replication process is not smart enough to
understand that this is the same server. Is Veeam V5 Beta software, and not all features are complete yet ?

What am I missing ?

Veeam please understand that VM's will move. Thats the idea behind VMWARE, easy to move resources.

I think this would work if I added the VM from Vcenter instead of the host directly, but then Veeam cannot VSS the server. So either way you are screwed.

How can this be fixed without starting over. 180GB over a WAN cannot happen. Is there some other product I can use. Veeam Replication seems to be very limited

when it comes to replication. It should be set it and forget it.

Gostev
SVP, Product Management
Posts: 24789
Liked: 3522 times
Joined: Jan 01, 2006 1:01 am
Location: Baar, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by Gostev » May 08, 2011 5:25 pm

This can be true depending on how you configured your jobs, and how you "moved" the VM.

This won't happen if you configure your jobs through vCenter server as opposed to individual hosts. If you move VM located under vCenter server, it will not change its unique ID, and therefore your jobs will not "brake". Unless of course instead of actually moving, you unregister and then register VM back (doing this will also create new unique ID for VM, and thus "break" existing jobs).

For more details on how Veeam B&R tracks virtual machines see my response here > Backups break after host remove/add

Thanks.

cag
Enthusiast
Posts: 74
Liked: never
Joined: Mar 26, 2011 4:02 am
Full Name: Conrad Gotzmann
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by cag » May 09, 2011 12:19 am

Any plans to fix this.
Seems very limited and a very poor design.
I do replicate using host because I cannot backup via vcenter, vss wont work then.
Please fix replication to work and support what real people do. Things move and change.

tsightler
VP, Product Management
Posts: 5418
Liked: 2240 times
Joined: Jun 05, 2009 12:57 pm
Full Name: Tom Sightler
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by tsightler » May 09, 2011 1:28 am

You should really try to figure out why VSS doesn't work when you use vCenter because that doesn't make any real sense at all. Veeam does exactly the same things when added via vCenter as when added via the host so there's no reason VSS shouldn't work. I replicate all of my hosts via vCenter and VSS works fine and I move my VM's occasionally just as designed.

cag
Enthusiast
Posts: 74
Liked: never
Joined: Mar 26, 2011 4:02 am
Full Name: Conrad Gotzmann
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by cag » May 09, 2011 4:59 am

VSS Doesn't work because Vcenter is running in the VM, It works with all other VM's except the one were VCenter is running.

Is there somthing I need to change to make vss work where vcenter is running.

Vitaliy S.
Product Manager
Posts: 22984
Liked: 1556 times
Joined: Mar 30, 2009 9:13 am
Full Name: Vitaliy Safarov
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by Vitaliy S. » May 09, 2011 8:48 am

The only possible way to backup vCenter Server with VSS is to use direct host connection, otherwise while being frozen vCenter Server wouldn't be able to process API calls which are essential to move the backup process forward. In other words, this causes a "deadlock" and backup fails out after timeout.

As for whether to use direct host connection or vCenter Server, then certainly you should configure all backup/replication jobs through vCenter Server, as it will make all your jobs "VMotion" aware.

tsightler
VP, Product Management
Posts: 5418
Liked: 2240 times
Joined: Jun 05, 2009 12:57 pm
Full Name: Tom Sightler
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by tsightler » May 09, 2011 12:55 pm

cag wrote:VSS Doesn't work because Vcenter is running in the VM, It works with all other VM's except the one were VCenter is running.

Is there somthing I need to change to make vss work where vcenter is running.
OK, I see. Yes, we have this issue as well and we also add the vCenter VM directly via the ESX host. But backing up the vCenter VM is a unique circumstance and your original post implies that this is some major shortcoming in Veeam's design, but there's actually pretty good reasons why this specific use case is a difficult situation to handle. Obviously you cannot backup vCenter with VSS while using VSS because vCenter can't process any commands while the VSS state is frozen, and obviously Veeam would have difficulty tracking VM's if you add them directly via the ESX host since, well, if you move it, that VM is no longer on that host.

But this problem doesn't exist for any other VM. There are two reasonable workarounds:

1. Configure the vCenter VM with a pre-freeze script to trigger a normal SQL backup of the vCenter database (or simply schedule a normal SQL backup of the vCenter database sometime prior to the Veeam backup of this host) and simply don't use VSS for this host, knowing that, if you have to restore the vCenter VM, and the backup isn't crash consistent (it probably will be fine) then you may need to perform a native SQL restore from the last backup.

2. Do you best not to move the vCenter VM very often and, if you do, know that you have to edit the job to re-add this VM. This is only for this specific VM and will not affect any VM's added via vCenter.

ccrichard
Enthusiast
Posts: 26
Liked: never
Joined: Sep 04, 2010 11:06 pm
Full Name: Richard Yamauchi
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by ccrichard » May 09, 2011 2:41 pm

why not just use a sqlcmd script to backup the database? As Long as you have a template or standby VM you can just recover the sql database.

------Oops, sorry, Somebody beat me to this suggestion.

Gostev
SVP, Product Management
Posts: 24789
Liked: 3522 times
Joined: Jan 01, 2006 1:01 am
Location: Baar, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by Gostev » May 09, 2011 6:07 pm

Just wanted to add that, as other people already mentioned, there is no way for us to track VM moving from one host from another when you configure your jobs through standalone hosts. Because our engine can only use host-level unique VM ID in this case, after you move the VM to another host, new host will assign different host-level VM ID. And, as I explained in the above-referenced topic, the only reliable way to match VM is using its unique ID. Anything else will simply not work (things like name, disk sizes etc. are too common). Thus, there is no way for our engine to match newly registered VM into some one old one (and there will never be the way). Our engine simply cannot know if this is the same VM with the information it has available: only you yourself know this.

And, in fact, our next version will enable you to leverage your knowledge ;) We are planning to provide you with ability to setup mapping between source and existing target VM manually, and this will resolve your biggest issue (requirement of full replication over WAN).

Thanks.

chazhill
Novice
Posts: 4
Liked: never
Joined: Sep 06, 2011 1:48 pm
Full Name: Chaz Hill
Contact:

Moving VMs to different ESXI Host

Post by chazhill » Nov 01, 2011 2:35 pm

[merged]

Hi Guys,

If I move a VM to another ESXI host can I change the job in Veeam to reflect the move or would I have to create a brand new backup job?

chazhill
Novice
Posts: 4
Liked: never
Joined: Sep 06, 2011 1:48 pm
Full Name: Chaz Hill
Contact:

Re: This cannot be true !

Post by chazhill » Nov 01, 2011 3:04 pm

Well it looks like I got my answer, thanks!

Scott
Lurker
Posts: 2
Liked: never
Joined: Sep 06, 2012 9:59 pm
Full Name: Scott Campbell
Contact:

Migrate Guests to new Host

Post by Scott » Sep 06, 2012 10:50 pm

[merged]

Hello,

I am looking moving the guests on one of my ESXi5 hosts over to some shiny new hardware :-)

This host has the guests on local storage and a RDM. We also VB&R 6.1 to replicate the guests to a remote DR site.

I know I can use the VM Copy functionality to copy over to the new kit, my question is what happens with the replication job - will it just continue without missing a beat if I change the host that VB&R is pointing to - or will I need to effectively use the existing replicas as a seed?

Cheers,
Scott

foggy
Veeam Software
Posts: 18257
Liked: 1559 times
Joined: Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson
Contact:

Re: Moving VMs to different host

Post by foggy » Sep 07, 2012 7:58 am

Scott, for replication jobs to continue flawlessly, it's better to move the VM (not copy and re-register) using native vSphere tools or Veeam B&R Quick Migration feature. Otherwise, you have to edit replication jobs to point them to the new VMs on source and mapping them to the right VMs on target. Thanks!

Scott
Lurker
Posts: 2
Liked: never
Joined: Sep 06, 2012 9:59 pm
Full Name: Scott Campbell
Contact:

Re: Moving VMs to different host

Post by Scott » Sep 07, 2012 11:05 am

Ah thank you. I'll give that a shot.

Cheers,
Scott

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 49 guests