REFS 4k horror story

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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby Gostev » Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:29 am

JaySt wrote:if this patch would fix the problems seen in this thread and for which Veeam is so actively trying come up with a fix with MS , i think we would have seen some sort of announcement through Gostev maybe, something like "we're getting close to a fix.. hold on...". Would be quite special to have a patch (or THE patch) drop down from the sky like this.

Correct :D as per the quoted response from Microsoft support on the previous page, they are currently porting the hot fix to the current branch.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby mkretzer » Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:12 pm

So... if i understand corretly they solved the performance issues for some (us included) but not the crash issue which others with not enough RAM have?
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby Gostev » Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:41 pm

Excessive RAM usage was the very first issue they have solved.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby kubimike » Mon Jul 24, 2017 1:41 am

observation worth mentioning. Even though Im running the latest patch with the beta refs driver I am seeing improved speed with fast clones. It went from 5 hours back to roughly 2-1/2 hours. Im not sure what else they fixed but its an improvement for sure!
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby mkretzer » Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:41 am

We ported all our backups back to REFS last weekend. One thing worth mentioning is that the active fulls were really fast. I checked the statistics and most active fulls were even faster than with NTFS on the same storage! It was completely different with the "old" REFS driver where it was always much slower than with NTFS!
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby pesos » Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:44 am

Trying to get up to speed here as we have been seeing crashes on our on-host backups recently. At this point is there anything we need to do other than fully patch our hosts and Veeam servers via windows update?
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby kubimike » Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:51 am

crucial question, WHEN does it crash and we can guide you. Time the job with what is happening, take a look at the logs report back.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby lepphce1 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:07 pm

I received the following reply from Microsoft support regarding my 0x133 BSOD events.

Due to complexity of the code changes required to handle the hard WS limit.

At this point, you should check with the backup software vendor if they are using the API to set the hard limit on WS and if affirmative, then recommend them not to do so.

NtSetSystemInformation api called with flag MM_WORKING_SET_MAX_HARD_ENABLE.
This API requires that caller has SeIncreaseQuotaPrivilege privilege.

Kindly check with your backup vendor if they are using the above mention ApI.


I opened a ticket with Veeam support, and was told to pose the question to the forums so Tier 3 or a developer could address it.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby mkaec » Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:25 pm

lepphce1 wrote:I opened a ticket with Veeam support, and was told to pose the question to the forums so Tier 3 or a developer could address it.

That doesn't seem right. I love that tier 3 and development participate in the forums, but if support cannot communicate internally with them, that's pretty dysfunctional.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby lepphce1 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:04 pm

mkaec wrote:That doesn't seem right. I love that tier 3 and development participate in the forums, but if support cannot communicate internally with them, that's pretty dysfunctional.

I thought it was odd as well.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby Gostev » Sat Jul 29, 2017 1:15 am 1 person likes this post

mkaec wrote:I love that tier 3 and development participate in the forums

Except they don't... but in any case, the response would be totally unacceptable even if they were here. Sorry about that - I've been fighting this behavior as well, but it does keep happening. I am not sure what's up with that. I have forwarded this to the support management for review.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby j.forsythe » Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:58 am

Hi there.
I updated the server and I am running on ReFS 10.0.14393.1532.
At the moment it seems like it is really slow (compared to NTFS), but the merge to synthetic full seems to be working without locking the server.
I have a ReFS iSCSI target at ta Synology NAS and it is running like a charm for months, it ain't super fast but it is doing its job.
I have the strange feeling that Storage Spaces is causing some issues, so I will change the RAID setup.
At the moment I am running Storage Spaces and I want to change it to a HP RAID.

There was a post where someone had experienced problems with a certain cluster size when creating the new RAID, but I cannot find it anymore.
Could that someone please point me to the right settings, BIG thank you!

I will keep you guys updated.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby antipolis » Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:01 am

refering to this ? https://www.virtualtothecore.com/en/veeam-backups-slow-check-stripe-size/

storage spaces is a disaster imho
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby dellock6 » Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:58 am

I would not call storage spaces a disaster, but indeed so far it proved to be slower than any hardware raid solution. We are suggesting customers use for now hardware raid solutions and avoid storage spaces, if you want to have high performance, especially parity modes. You lose self-healing of blocks without mirror or parity modes, but you still have scrubbing, and higher performance. A good hardware raid card is one of the first design choices to be done when building a server repository.
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Re: REFS 4k horror story

Veeam Logoby lepphce1 » Mon Jul 31, 2017 1:25 pm

Gostev wrote:Except they don't... but in any case, the response would be totally unacceptable even if they were here. Sorry about that - I've been fighting this behavior as well, but it does keep happening. I am not sure what's up with that. I have forwarded this to the support management for review.

@Gostev I sent you my case number via PM. Thanks!
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