ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Availability for the Always-On Enterprise

ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby doggatas » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:33 pm

By the nature of Block Cloning the most disk space savings are had on the Full Backups. I need to move a bunch of GFS backups to a new Repo. If I have a Backup Copy Job sitting on a ReFS repo is there anyway I can move those files to another ReFS repo (different volume) and retain the space savings or once I copy those files off the ReFS volume they were created on, are they always written at their full size at the destination?

Regards,
David
doggatas
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 38
Liked: 2 times
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:15 am
Full Name: David O

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby foggy » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:39 am

Hi David, it's the second, copying files to another volume inflates them.
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 16306
Liked: 1302 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby doggatas » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:32 pm

Thanks. I will start a new backup chain on the new repo.

Regards,
David
doggatas
Enthusiast
 
Posts: 38
Liked: 2 times
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:15 am
Full Name: David O

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby mkretzer » Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:57 am

Will that change in V10? I mean it is not really that unlikely that with a long GFS chain you have to change the hardware at some point and then you will loose all the space savings...
mkretzer
Expert
 
Posts: 386
Liked: 77 times
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:17 am

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby foggy » Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:32 pm

It is actually not specific to Veeam B&R, but to ReFS itself (think like volumes with Data Deduplication enabled).
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 16306
Liked: 1302 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby mkretzer » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:02 pm

I know - but can Veeam not find out if a block is cloned and move it with the reference to the new block address on the new volume?
mkretzer
Expert
 
Posts: 386
Liked: 77 times
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:17 am

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby foggy » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:20 pm

No, there's no such copying functionality in Veeam B&R.
foggy
Veeam Software
 
Posts: 16306
Liked: 1302 times
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:22 am
Full Name: Alexander Fogelson

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby GrNathan » Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:52 am

@mkretzer it's worth noting that the feature you are asking about possibly being added to Veeam v10 would more usefully be requested of Microsoft as a possible enhancement to the ReFS engine. Like @foggy mentioned, it's analgous to a volume that has Data Depulication enabled, where copy/move actions to other volumes will trigger 'rehydration' of de-duplicated data. Solutions to this are

1. Start a new backup chain, as original poster has opted for in this scenario.
2. Assuming sufficient available storage ( and IOPS capacity plus CPU time) on the new volume, copy the data from old volume to new volume and allow the rehydrated data to go through deduplication again.

Neither of these are pain-free scenarios, but thats why we pay careful attention when we do our capacity-planning work to avoid having to do too many storage-platform rip & replace operations, right?
GrNathan
Service Provider
 
Posts: 1
Liked: never
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:42 am
Full Name: Nathan Gracie

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby Henrik.Grevelund » Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:06 am

Hi there

There are a couple of times where it would be nice if Veeam had a "Move existing backup jobs intelligent":

-Migrating jobs from one REFS volume to another without re-hydrating them
-Rebuild the second or third copy with GFS jobs
--When a data loss occurs it would be nice to set Veeam to recopy the GFS points
---if the second copy is encrypted its not possible just to copy the local files since they aren't encrypted
-Move from one service provider to another without loosing GFS history

Have a nice day,
Henrik
Have nice day,
Henrik
Henrik.Grevelund
Service Provider
 
Posts: 33
Liked: never
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 2:56 pm
Full Name: Henrik Grevelund

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby MikeK » Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:25 pm 1 person likes this post

There is one way to accomplish this although it may not meet some of the requirements discussed here. It's actually quite simple ... you just have to think like a storage admin.

1) Disable your backups to the ReFS repo
2) ... Perform a "clone" operation of the underlying volume on the SAN. I say "clone" because many manufacturers call this something proprietary. Basically we're looking for an identical copy of the volume. It is also possible (again depending on your SAN) to clone to a remote location and a different SAN altogether.
3) Remove the original vol and map the new. It will look the same because it is the same.
4) Enable your backups

This would work to get through something like a storage refresh and installing new hardware. Sizing is important because larger vols require more time to clone. We are still putting ReFS through testing in our environment before deploying in place of NTFS. Having the ability to move data is critical. Backups with small chains can be reseeded but any type of extended retention complicates writing to ReFS when you think about the current challenges in performance, stability and mobility. One of the particularly interesting use cases is what Gostev mentions in his Jan 21 update and Archival. In a cost/GB model that you might use for Veeam Cloud Connect or and as we are evaluating, IAAS the possibilities are very exciting :D
MikeK
Novice
 
Posts: 3
Liked: 1 time
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:46 pm
Full Name: Michael Kee

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby adapterer » Wed Jan 31, 2018 4:13 am 4 people like this post

You can accomplish this with Windows Storage Replica if you have datacenter edition - https://www.virtualtothecore.com/en/win ... s-volumes/
Depending on your setup you could use Veeam agent to backup as it works at block level and restore to the new volume - but I have not tested this.
adapterer
Service Provider
 
Posts: 224
Liked: 42 times
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:24 pm

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby ITP-Stan » Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:33 pm

Using Veeam Agent's Volume Backup / Restore: That's a nice idea!
Can we get some confirmation this will work as intended?
ITP-Stan
Service Provider
 
Posts: 86
Liked: 10 times
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:45 am
Full Name: Stan (IF-IT4U)

Re: ReFS: Moving Backup Copy Job to new ReFS Repo

Veeam Logoby jandrewartha » Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:48 am

Someone also suggested disk2vhd which would probably be good for a once off. Veeam Windows agent for server has CBT for ReFS which would be necessary for repeated backups.

It'd be nice to having something that pulls the image, we're pondering ways to get an offline copy of our long-term (12mo+, 26TB atm) backup copy repository that's updated once a week, both for cryptolocker recovery and in case the whole server dies in a fire for some reason, we don't lose that backup history.

Right now I'm thinking a two stage backup, Veeam agent backup to our old netapp, then a small server that boots up automatically (BIOS/UEFI control?), copies the image over, emails success then shuts down again, but I'm sure this could be simplified.
jandrewartha
Novice
 
Posts: 8
Liked: never
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:49 am


Return to Veeam Backup & Replication



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 30 guests