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Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Dave-Departed » Aug 21, 2013 8:29 am

Hi All,

Testing WAN acceleration and Backup Copy Jobs, as per my thread yesterday... And unless I'm still being thick, I'm stuck!

I have a 200GB full backup file (copied from an existing v6.5 backup), which I've uploaded to my offsite repository, which I want to use to seed a new Backup Copy Job from. I've rescanned the offsite repository in Veeam, and I've even imported the backup into the Veeam console (where it shows under Imported Backups), but when I go to add it to my Backup Copy Job, I just can't see the VM anywhere other than browsing to it through Infrastructure? Which means I can't seem to choose the offsite backup file to be mapped to, for seeding?

Obviously, I'm aware that it's a different process to seeding a regular backup in 6.5, but I just can't seem to figure out how to do this (on my test v7 server, I don't have the disk space to host the copied backup file, hence why I've copied it up to the offsite repository).

Can anyone point me in the right direction, please?

Thanks in advance

Dave

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Dave-Departed » Aug 21, 2013 8:39 am

More information:

Even if I try to create a standard backup job, and map the job to the offsite backup file, when I browse the offsite repository, the imported backup file doesn't show up.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by foggy » Aug 21, 2013 9:37 am

Dave, are you able to add the copied backup at the Target step of the Backup Copy Job Wizard, after selecting Map Backup?

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Dave-Departed » Aug 21, 2013 9:39 am

Hi Foggy,

No, it doesn't show up there, only the jobs that I created from scratch in v7 are there.

Thanks

Dave

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Vitaliy S. » Aug 21, 2013 9:42 am

Dave-Departed wrote:I've rescanned the offsite repository in Veeam, and I've even imported the backup into the Veeam console (where it shows under Imported Backups), but when I go to add it to my Backup Copy Job, I just can't see the VM anywhere other than browsing to it through Infrastructure?
Did your backup files show up in the backup console after you've rescanned the repository? There is no need to import backup files to the console if you run a rescan operation.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Dave-Departed » Aug 21, 2013 9:46 am

Hi Vitaly,

No, they didn't show up after a rescan. No idea why!

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Vitaliy S. » Aug 21, 2013 9:50 am

Ok, this is the problem. Your backup files should appear in the console first and then you would be able to map your backup copy job to these files. Did you transfer the vbm file as well?

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Dave-Departed » Aug 21, 2013 9:59 am

Ok, so I've just removed and re-added the affected backup (including the VBM file too, yes), and rescanned the repository... And this time it has picked it up!

However, I'm now getting the same behaviour as described in that other topic - ie when I try to map the backup at the Target stage, I get the message "No backup is attached. Cannot map a backup". Obviously I only have the VBM and latest VBK file in there (it comes from a reverse incremental job originally, so the latest VBK is a full backup). If I browse the backup file in the Veeam console, I can see it has 14 restore points associated with it, but obviously they are not there because I didn't import the VRB files. How do I get round this, please?

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Vitaliy S. » Aug 21, 2013 10:26 am

Another reason why you cannot map your backup files could the version of these copied files. I didn't pay attention that you're trying to do that using backup files created by version 6.5. If you have an opportunity, can you please try to create active full using version 7 and then map your backup copy job to this newly created backup file?

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by veremin » Aug 21, 2013 10:30 am

I’m also wondering what the source of the backup copy job is. Is it a backup job or individual VMs, instead? Thanks.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Dave-Departed » Aug 21, 2013 10:35 am

Vitaliy S. wrote:Another reason why you cannot map your backup files could the version of these copied files. I didn't pay attention that you're trying to do that using backup files created by version 6.5. If you have an opportunity, can you please try to create active full using version 7 and then map your backup copy job to this newly created backup file?
I will try this, yes. It will just take a while, as our bandwidth is only 10mb, and it will have to be done over the WAN, as I don't have the space on my local v7 VBR server to hold a full backup.
v.Eremin wrote:I’m also wondering what the source of the backup copy job is. Is it a backup job or individual VMs, instead? Thanks.
It's a backup job, but it only contains a single VM.

Thanks

dave

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Dave-Departed » Aug 21, 2013 11:06 am

Ok, so I'm getting somewhere!!

Created a regular backup job, and mapped it to the offsite backup successfully... Changed both the Restore Points and Retention values to 1, and now I'm running that regular job, and it has removed all restore points and appears to be creating a new restore point. Looks like it's gonna take a while (the VM size is actually almost 1TB), but once that's done, it should work with a Backup Copy Job, I guess!

Will update this thread once the job(s) are finished!

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by foggy » Aug 21, 2013 12:41 pm

In fact you should be able to map the job to the backup created by v6.5. Most likely the reason of the error is the same as in that adjacent thread - the full backup is taken from the reversed incremental backup chain and vbm file contains information about increments:
Dave-Departed wrote:If I browse the backup file in the Veeam console, I can see it has 14 restore points associated with it, but obviously they are not there because I didn't import the VRB files. How do I get round this, please?

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by Vitaliy S. » Aug 21, 2013 4:36 pm

Yes, I have just talked to our QC team and it appears that you can only map backup copy job to the active full backup only, there shouldn't be any incremental files present in the backup chain.

If you do not want to run active full against the production VMs, here is a small tip/workaround that might help you:

1. Create any backup copy job on the local site
2. Add VMs you want to create backup files for to this job
3. Run this job to create a vbk file on any new local repository. Make sure your synchrotinzation interval ("Copy every" parameter) covers all VM restore points available on the main backup repository
4. Move newly created vbk file (and vbm) to the offsite repository
5. Run a re-scan job to pouplate backup console with that vbk file
6. Configure your "main" backup copy job to use the vbk file you've added to the remote repository in the backup mapping step of the wizard
7. Click "Sync now" to run your "main" backup copy job

Should work!

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by smassey » Aug 24, 2013 3:11 am

Vitaliy S. wrote:Yes, I have just talked to our QC team and it appears that you can only map backup copy job to the active full backup only, there shouldn't be any incremental files present in the backup chain.

If you do not want to run active full against the production VMs, here is a small tip/workaround that might help you:

1. Create any backup copy job on the local site
2. Add VMs you want to create backup files for to this job
3. Run this job to create a vbk file on any new local repository. Make sure your synchrotinzation interval ("Copy every" parameter) covers all VM restore points available on the main backup repository
4. Move newly created vbk file (and vbm) to the offsite repository
5. Run a re-scan job to pouplate backup console with that vbk file
6. Configure your "main" backup copy job to use the vbk file you've added to the remote repository in the backup mapping step of the wizard
7. Click "Sync now" to run your "main" backup copy job

Should work!
Vitaly,

I have a question or two about this. My situation is a probably very similar to Dave's. I already back up directly to my offsite location, but I want to improve performance and shorten backup times by backing up locally and then using the backup job copy feature to ship deltas to my offsite location and use GFS retention schedules for long term storage. Due to the many constraints that I'm facing (bandwidth, lack of access to the data centers, travel times, consultant fees for simply plugging the drive in, etc) shipping the backup down there might not be feasible. However, I already have a lot of data at the remote site.

Based on the procedure you wrote above, can I do the following:
1. Create a backup copy job at the remote site using one of the jobs I already have stored at that site.
2. Run the sync for that site
3. Create a new backup job at my local site.
4. Map the new backup at my local site to the full backup that I just created at my remote site.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by foggy » Aug 24, 2013 9:22 am

Sure, this should also work. You will get the required single VBK from your remotely stored backup chain and will be able to map the new backup copy job to this VBK.

That said, I would note that having backup chains already at remote site you can benefit from backup copy job even without actually mapping it. Before starting synchronization of the VM with particular OS, WAN accelerator cache is populated by this OS data from the backups stored at the target repository, so WAN link load during backup copy job will be less than it would be to an empty repository.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by smassey » Aug 26, 2013 11:52 am

Foggy,

That would be great if I had an Enterprise Plus license. :D

I was able to confirm that the procedure on the last page worked, and I was able to use the backups at my remote site to seed a backup copy job and then switch the job so that it updated from one at my primary site.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by foggy » Aug 26, 2013 11:56 am

Thanks for confirming that, much appreciated!

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by danielchung » Aug 29, 2013 3:04 am

Currently I have the same setup which is a local backup job and a remote backup job. In remote repository, there is a number of full backup files and chains of incremental backup files. Now I'd like to replace the remote backup job with backup copy job. Knowing that I can make use of the existing backup at remote repository as seed for backup copy job, but here I know that I must use a single vbk file instead of a chain of backup files.

We have slow WAN, so would like avoid any big transfer over it. My question is what is the trick to "transform" my existing backup chain into a latest vbk file so that I can map it in backup copy job? I'm a bit confused with the steps mentioned in previous posts. Can someone show it again clearly?

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by foggy » Aug 29, 2013 7:16 am

You should be using the following procedure, outlined above:
smassey wrote: 1. Create a backup copy job at the remote site using one of the jobs I already have stored at that site.
2. Run the sync for that site
3. Create a new backup job at my local site.
4. Map the new backup at my local site to the full backup that I just created at my remote site.
If you need further clarification, feel free to ask.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by danielchung » Aug 29, 2013 8:52 am

foggy,

Finally I re-created a new vbk file from my existing backup chains. Then in the backup copy job, I changed to use my local backup job as source. However, the backup copy job always return status "Restore point is located in backup file with different block size" and stopped. Searched around here and found this topic. Based on what you've mentioned there, I have to re-create the backup file from scratch with the backup job. Does it mean that make use of existing backup file in backup copy job in my case will not work?

In the local backup job, I've tried to change the storage optimization to "WAN target" to match the same setting in the remote backup job, then run the local backup job once but doesn't help. :(

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by foggy » Aug 29, 2013 9:14 am

danielchung wrote:Based on what you've mentioned there, I have to re-create the backup file from scratch with the backup job.
Actually, I haven't stated that in the topic you're referring to. ;) You do not need to re-create the backup, you just need to create the new backup copy job and add VMs from the backup job. Have you tried that?

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by danielchung » Aug 29, 2013 9:39 am

Yes I did delete and create a new backup copy job, select backup job as source and map previously created backup, but still giving me the same message.

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by veremin » Aug 29, 2013 10:57 am

The new block size will be applied after new full backup takes place. So, you might want to run an active full backup and see whether it helps or not. Otherwise, you can clone/recreate a local backup job, change block size settings, then, perform initial run and use it a source for backup copy job. Thanks.

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[MERGED] : Backup Copy seed procedure

Post by RobPerry88 » Oct 25, 2013 8:45 am

Hi,

I'm trying to get a Backup Copy job to use a pre-seeded Repository, searching is only giving lots hits for the Backup part of Veeam non for the Backup Copy and I want to ensure what I'm attempting is supported.

Steps Taken

Backup Copy job setup to copy a Backup job to a NAS over a local connection
Once the seed has completed the NAS is taken Offsite
The Repository has to be removed and then added back to Veeam (I can't edit the IP)
I recreate the Backup copy job to use the same folder on the NAS with the pre-existing backups.

It then seemingly fails to recognize the seed and wants to do a full initial seed again.

Is what I'm trying to achieve supported or am I going about it the wrong way.

Thanks,

Rob

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by veremin » Oct 25, 2013 8:50 am

Hi, Rob, your post has been merged into existing discussion regarding backup copy job seeding. Kindly, take a look at the answers provided above, and ask for additional clarification, if required.

Thanks.

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[MERGED] BACKUP COPY JOBS Seed offsite via usb

Post by ober72 » May 07, 2014 11:41 pm

Hi Folks,

I have read the documentation but would appreciate it if you can confirm that I am doing this right since I will only get one shot before I send the USB crosscountry ;)

I created local backups and paused them just in case after first full (this pause might not be needed if not please tell me), then I created a new temp repository on a usb drive. I am running Backup copy jobs to the USB drive until I get one full backup (here is where I think it means to only create one full backup so that you can later map to it). I then temporarily disable the backup copy jobs.

Then I will disconnect the usb ship it off to the DR location copy the jobs over to the new repository. I will then connect with a vpn create the new repository while ticking import backups. I will then create wan accellerators both locally and remotely. Then I will go back to the Backup copy jobs and map them to the new repository, they then should in B&R appear under disk and not imported backups. At this point I change the target to the new repository. I then re-enable the backup copy jobs and they can do their first tranfer.

Please correct me if I am wrong anywhere. Also when I disconnect the USB will Veeam go bananas because it can't see a repository?

thanks

a newbie to Veeeam
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Re: [MERGED] BACKUP COPY JOBS Seed offsite via usb

Post by foggy » May 08, 2014 8:33 am

Hello Geoff, welcome to the Veeam Community Forums. Please find the step by step backup copy seeding procedure in the thread above.
ober72 wrote:Also when I disconnect the USB will Veeam go bananas because it can't see a repository?
No, you can safely remove the media if the jobs targeted to it are disabled (otherwise they will fail).

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by mvank » May 20, 2014 2:46 pm

Hi,

I am also in the progress of using Backup Copy Job, with the seeding options, but had also some isuses.
As i assumed a copy of the latest synthetic full and move the copy to a target location (by portable media), but nog Backup was found doing a Repository Rescan, until i also moved the .vmb file.
Now the Backup file is automatically imported, but still cannot be mapped. As i read that a active full must be performed, and this files must be transfered to the target location (will be tested tonigh).

but i am investigating to change the stragetie from Incremental-Synthetic full to Reverse Incremental, will the Backup Copy still work?
as our Synthentic full takes a very long time to complete. I didn't read in this post, that someone is using Backup Copy Job icm with Reverse-Increment backups.

Regards,
Michel

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Re: Seeding offsite backup files for a Backup Copy Job

Post by foggy » May 20, 2014 3:47 pm

mvank wrote:As i assumed a copy of the latest synthetic full and move the copy to a target location (by portable media), but nog Backup was found doing a Repository Rescan, until i also moved the .vmb file.
Correct, VBM file is required for rescan procedure to import the corresponding backup files.
mvank wrote:Now the Backup file is automatically imported, but still cannot be mapped. As i read that a active full must be performed, and this files must be transfered to the target location (will be tested tonigh).
Correct, backup copy job can be mapped to a single full backup file only.
mvank wrote:but i am investigating to change the stragetie from Incremental-Synthetic full to Reverse Incremental, will the Backup Copy still work?
It doesn't matter what backup mode is used by the source backup job, since backup copy job synthetically creates required restore points in target location using VM data in source backup repositories.

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