Forever forward and synthesizing full to tape

[roms]

We bought VBR V8.0 and want to create backup copies of 10 virtual machines in the environment Vsphere 5.5. The total size of the VM's 4.5 GB, 3.2 GB occupied. We need to backup all 5 working days to disk (incremental) and at the end of the week to tape LTO-6. Our repository 13.6 GB and Retention Policy - 60 Restore points. I decided to use Veeam innovation and began using:
1. "Forever forward incremental" backup every 5 days a week (it is clear that the first backup is full).
2. Use the "Virtual Synthesized Full Backup to tape" a day later after the last incremental

Questions:
- If need to mark "Process incremental backup files" for synthesizing the last incremental to the new full VBK on tape?

- If during the week I decreased the size of the VM and translated them into an archive and the end of the week instead of 3.2 GB left 2GB capacity occupied in virtual machines that "Virtual Synthesized Full Backup to tape" will create a file on the tape VBK size of 2GB or remain around 2.9 GB was like a week ago?

[Dima P.]

Hello Rachman and welcome to Veeam forums,

If need to mark "Process incremental backup files" for synthesizing the last incremental to the new full VBK on tape?

Yes

If during the week I decreased the size of the VM and translated them into an archive and the end of the week instead of 3.2 GB left 2GB capacity occupied in virtual machines that "Virtual Synthesized Full Backup to tape" will create a file on the tape VBK size of 2GB or remain around 2.9 GB was like a week ago?

If the changes applied before going to tape then yes.

[roms]

Thanks

[roms]

Attempt 1: "Process incremental backup files" checked- Result: all 5 VBI copyed to tape, but not synthesizing VBK .... My Retention policy is 60 restore points
Attempt 2: "Process incremental backup files" unchecked- Result: "nothing to backup"
Attempt 3: Return "Process incremental backup files" checking + Schedule tape job to "After this job" -> My_Backup_Job - Result: create .VSB file and synthesizing VBK to tape,
but leave all 5 incremental backups in tape.

What is? Bug?

Recommendations? Leaving aside innovations and move on "Synthetic Full + Transform" type of B2D or Veeam developers are already preparing Patch?

[veremin]

Hi, Rachman, currently there are issues related to synthesized full backup. Thus, I would recommend opening a ticket with our support team and letting them confirm your environment. Thanks.

[wbauer84]

Hi roms,

Just, if you didn't saw the other post of me in the forum:
We experience exactly the same problems, at two different 8.0 installations:
"process incremental backup files" NOT CHECKED: "nothing to backup (except there was in between a migration of an vib file into the vbk on HDD because of exceeding restore points)
"process incremental backup files" CHECKED: at least vbk + vib files (of this day), and in some cases ALSO he tries to backup MORE than one synthesized vbk file, which leads to, that our tape library with LTO-6 is written fully by one tape job, all 8 tapes!
case # open for this problems (at our customers):
# 00689913
# 00680258

[roms]

I temporarily moved to another type of backup: "Synthetic Full + Transform"
Could be left forever forward and do at the end of the week Active Full for later copying to tape, but it is a manual process.
I'm new to VEEAM, after many years of working with Symantec, the lost weekend
and sleepless nights I had very pleased with Veeam. I believe that the problem with synthetic full copy to tape will be fixed soon.
Thank you for your comment.

[saddison]

We are having a similar issue with our tape environment. Our jobs are creating multiple synthetic fulls to tape. One of our jobs is over 3TB. The full to tape tried to write 5 synthesized full backups to tape, for a total of 15TB of data. We have an open ticket as well (00688652).

At first, I thought it was going back and grabbing every incremental that was created on a particular day and creating fulls from those. One of our jobs did this. For example, if you have the synthetic full to tape created on a Saturday and had 4 previous incrementals that were created on Saturdays, it attempted to create 4 synthetic fulls from these. However, other jobs will attempt to create synthetic fulls from seemingly random days.

I have yet to find a pattern.

I hope a patch is coming soon. This great feature is not usable in it's current form.

[martynuk]

We have a similar, but not identical issue. We create weekly synthetic full backups on disk, and the backup to tape job is configured to copy these synthetic full backups to tape. Since upgrading to v8, each synthetic full backup is being sent to tape multiple times. The configuration of the backup jobs themselves hasn't changed. Veeam are investigating - Case # 00690220.

[roms]

Yes Martynuk, Synthetic Full created OK, but how it came to tape backup problems started:
1. Probably not erased the old files on the tape.
2. The job for some reason includes all reverse incremental files created as a result of Synthetic Full from VIBs.
I did not choose incremental backup files for this job.

Quest asked to insert another tape, since there is no longer space on the tape.

[veremin]

2) Have you implemented the hotfix already? Thanks.

[martynuk]

I implemented hot fix KB1949. Prior to doing so i couldn't run the backup to tape job at all (the job repeatedly failed with "MediaPool not found (id: 00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000)." errors. Now I just get my full backups being copied to tape multiple times.

[Dima P.]

Martin,

DEV team is looking at your case – once they find what the root of this issue is, support team will contact you with the details. Sorry for any inconvenience caused and thank you for your patience!

[Dave338]

I have a similar issue.

When I launch the backup to tape job, with full virtual backup of "thursday", for example, it makes two virtual synthesized of two different thursdays (the two I have with my retention period).. I expected to do only last one, wich is the one I want to save to tape

When I enabled all days to be virtual synthesized, I launch the tape job once, and it creates 9 (my actual rest. points), virtual full backups on disk, which become 9 full backups on tape.
Any info on this behaviours??

Is there a method to make only one full synthesized on a week day (and omit others of same day)

REgards.
Dave.

[Dima P.]

Hello Dave,

When I launch the backup to tape job, with full virtual backup of "thursday", for example, it makes two virtual synthesized of two different thursdays

It looks like expected - backup to tape checks the existing backup chain and creates a full backup from the increments from the day specified in the synthetic full backup schedule. For example if you run backup to tape once in two week for a backup to disk job it should create one synthesized full backups on tape for each week.

When I enabled all days to be virtual synthesized, I launch the tape job once, and it creates 9 (my actual rest. points), virtual full backups on disk, which become 9 full backups on tape.
Any info on this behaviours??

That is unexpected. You should get 7 synthesized full backups – one per each day. Please, check if you installed patch 1 and in case you did, please, open a support case.

[Dave338]

Well I opened this morning. (case 00748693)

I'm still understanding what this backup option makes.

I've just made a new test. Selecting one of my jobs, which has currently 10 restore points, and selecting virtual full on wednesday (only 1 wed. restore point currently)

Destination tape has all files copied, original vbk and all incrementals, except the wednesday one, that has been converted to a full backup. So 2 fulls, and rest of incrementals on tape, all 10 restore points to tape.

My goal was only to have the last restore point on tape, to make a weekly independent circuit (4-5 weeks), and 1 a month an independent monthly circuit (12 months), but I don't want original full nor incrementals on tape.

Regards.

[veremin]

Currently, synthesized full backup functionality requires "process incremental" option enabled. As the result, you see incremental backups being copied.

This will be addressed in patch#2, though.

Thanks.

[florian.meier]

Eremin do you know, when approximately patch#2 arrives?

[veremin]

In a few weeks from now.

[florian.meier]

Thank you!

[florian.meier]

hi guys

we are using now p2 for v8. the syntetic tape backup is running but not as expected.
when we creating a new full tape backup from a forever incremental and do not cross the "process incremental backup files"
then veeam creates two full backups on tape and not only one.
first full is the full from incremental forever, second full is the syntetic virtualized full of the tape backup schedule.

why that?

regards

[Shestakov]

Hello Florian,
Could you clarify when the job creates those Full backups? Did it copy the Full backup at first and then created another Full backups in few days? What`s your source backup job retention policy? Is it backup or backup copy job? Thanks!

[Steen]

hi guys

we are using now p2 for v8. the syntetic tape backup is running but not as expected.
when we creating a new full tape backup from a forever incremental and do not cross the "process incremental backup files"
then veeam creates two full backups on tape and not only one.
first full is the full from incremental forever, second full is the syntetic virtualized full of the tape backup schedule.

why that?

regards

i can confirm that.
Regards Steen

[martynuk]

We are seeing the same issue, and have a call open (case 00695194). It may be that Veeam sees that the existing VBK (from the forever incremental) is within the retention period for the media pool but isn't already on tape - so it copies it along with the virtual full. This isn't something we would want with a virtual full tape backup job, but I think may be how Veeam handles the traditional full backups to tape logic.

[veremin]

Guys, do you see the said behaviour during the first cycle only? Or whenever time for creating virtual full backup comes, there are two full backups archived to tapes (virtual one and the oldest point from forward forever incremental chain)?

[florian.meier]

Guys, do you see the said behaviour during the first cycle only?

i dont know, have about 20tb of data which have go to tape. so i have to double my tapes first...

Or whenever time for creating virtual full backup comes, there are two full backups archived to tapes (virtual one and the oldest point from forward forever incremental chain)?

yes thats correct. it creates two vbk. the virtual one and also the oldest from forward forever incremental chain.

[veremin]

i dont know, have about 20tb of data which have go to tape. so i have to double my tapes first...

I mean was it the first cycle of backup to tape job when two .vbks (with one of which being virtual full backup) were copied to tapes?

[florian.meier]

yes, was the first cycle! Cant speak for existing cycles because we migrated after p2 to veeam tape (because of the known problems in v8 without p2)

[martynuk]

First cycle here too. Don't know yet if similar behaviour will occur on subsequent cycles as I'm still testing.

[veremin]

If it's initial cycle, then, everything looks expected. However, starting from that moment, only one virtual full backup will be created on tape.